Season 1: Episode 5

Remote Viewing




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Episode Transcript

Stories of Strangeness Episode 5 Transcript


 Zoe: [00:00:28] Hello, and welcome to the fifth episode of stories of strangeness. 

Mike: [00:00:34] Hello, 

Zoe: [00:00:36] I’m Zoe. And this is Mike. 

Mike: [00:00:37] Hello. 

Zoe: [00:00:38] And this week Mike is presenting. So tell us. What are you presenting this week Mike? 

Mike: [00:00:43] I am doing remote viewing. 

Zoe: [00:00:46] Is that like when you look through a peephole? 

Mike: [00:00:48] Kind of, but a psychic peephole. Hashtag psychic peephole. 

Zoe: [00:00:53] Indeed.

Mike: [00:00:54] Oh Blimey. What have I started? 

Zoe: [00:00:56] Right, take it away love. 

Mike: [00:00:58] Alright, 


Russell Targ is an interesting guy. He’s a scientist, laser pioneer and legally blind motorcyclist. Born in Chicago in 1934, he received a BS in physics in 1954, and went on to be an early pioneer of lasers, including authoring papers on frequency modulation, and mode locking of lasers, as well as co-authoring a paper on the operation of a kilowatt continuous wave laser.

In this regard, his contribution to the study of physics can not be overstated. In one of many attempts to convince government scientists that what they considered impossible was absolutely possible, he  demonstrated his one kilowatt laser, which was only a meter long. At the time, the lasers owned by the government were a hundred times larger and much less powerful.

Russell’s demonstration consisted of using the laser to melt a red hot hole through a dense non-flammable Firebrick, which he then handed to the governor scientist, and asked him if he wants fries with that.  Introduced to the world of the paranormal at an early age by his father, who worked as an editor and owned a bookstore, which contained works by renowned occultist Helena Blavatsky and Eric Von Däniken whose seminal work, “Chariots of the Gods,” was stocked in the store.

He was also a childhood magician in New York, doing amongst other types, mental magic. He found that occasionally he would get actual impressions from people whose mind he was pretending to read as part of his act. He was told by other magicians that many magicians supplement their routine with whatever bits of ESP came to them during the show.  

 From 1972 to 1982, Targ worked at the Stanford Research Institute, a nonprofit science research center originally linked to Stanford university. It was during this period that Targ got involved with research centered around remote viewing. Remote viewing is, “The practice of seeking impressions about a distant or unseen target using subjective means in particular, extra sensory perception or ESP,” Basically a person has given a target: A building, a person, an object, or an event that is hidden from view, and normally at some distance from the viewer.

The term remote viewing was coined by target and Harold E.  Puthoff, the latter of whom was the founder of the program. The viewer is most usually given a set of coordinates and asked to draw, write, or otherwise describe their impressions of what is at that site. In 1972, Puthoff and Targ tested a man named Ingo Swan at SRI. Those experiments led to a visit from two employees of the CIA’s Directorate of Science and Technology, which resulted in a $50,000 CIA sponsored programme, known as the Stargate program.

Sri ran some form of ESP/remote viewing programme with Targ for 23 years, in conjunction with various US government agencies, including the CIA, NASA, and military defense intelligence agencies. Some of the projects they worked on for the CIA included finding a downed Russian plane in North Africa, which carried code books; locating a kidnapped American general in Northern Italy; looking into a Soviet weapons factory in Siberia; describing the construction of a huge Soviet submarine; and even used remote viewing to spy on a Chinese atomic bomb test three days before it was due to go off, and correctly determined that it would fail. 

Targ asserts that ESP is a natural ability that all people have to a lesser or greater degree, and that the ability works independently of physical distance and time. Talk tells us that using the ability to describe an object that’s hidden in his pocket while you were in the same room, has no difference in accuracy or reliability to describing something in Siberia over 6,000 miles away from SRI, and that this negation of distance was very interesting to him and his team as physicists. He references Buddhists who have lore regarding quieting the mind and being able to describe distant events and objects, thousands of years ago, and then Schrodinger who spoke about a non-local spacetime, and nonlocal connections in the 1920s, which was then proven in the 1970s.

His research, far from being new age was mainstream at the time. Written about in the main scientific journals of the world, as well as the New York times. Targ sought to prove that ESP ability could be trained and grown by the use of feedback mechanisms, and developed a test whereby four pictures were shown to the participant and they had to determine which one would become illuminated. The results were positive, and the program was taken up by NASA.

Targ now makes a similar test available as an iPhone app, called ESP trainer, where you get four placeholders, and you have to determine which one has the image behind. It. There’ll be a link to it in the show notes. 

In the famous Patty Hearst kidnapping case in the US in 1974, Targ took Pat Price, former police commissioner of Burbank, California, and psychic, to assist local law enforcement.

Pat correctly identified the ringleader of the kidnappers, simply by looking at mugshots, which was proven correct two weeks later. When asked if there was anything more imminent he could help with, Pat told them exactly where the gang’s car could be found, as well as the make, model, and color. They found the car 20 minutes later, due to his exacting information.

Another experiment developed in part to procure CIA funding, involved the psychic being in an electrically shielded room with Targ, and Hal Puthoff would go to a randomly chosen location, picked by the lab director; along with a contract monitor, lab director, or military general. In one instance, Pat Price described them at a water purification center, about five miles South of the lab, and drew out a plan of the place, including two tall water storage towers; a rectangular pool, 65 feet by 80 feet; and a round pool, a hundred feet in diameter. The target location was in fact, a swimming pool complex called Rinconada Park. The round pool turned out to be 110 feet in diameter, and the rectangular pool was 75 by a hundred feet – a 90% accuracy rate of measurements. And of course they were in the same places that Price had drawn on his plan. The only thing that Price had seemingly gotten wrong was the two water towers, which did not exist at the location. Except, when about 10 years ago, the city of Palo Alto sent Targ a picture book showing the city as it was 75 years ago.

In those photos, the Rinconada swimming pool complex had actually been a water purification plant, with, and you don’t necessarily need to be psychic to determine the answer, two large water storage towers. Price also described a secret NSA code facility in Virginia in another experiment, and could even read the folder titles, claiming, “The more you hide something, the brighter it shines in psychic space.”   

Another experiment had Price describe a facility from coordinates given to them, where there was a huge crane with four wheels at each corner, and a massive 60 foot steel sphere being welded together. The accuracy of the information led to a congressional hearing and investigation in case there had been a security leak, but eventually the program was allowed to continue as it was backed by the CIA and defense intelligence agencies. Targ even attempted a remote viewing himself during one experiment, where Puthoff was in Columbia, and each day, Price would describe Puthoff’s surroundings.

On day five, Price didn’t show up, so Targ, knowing how things were done from his observations, described an airport on an island with a runway that ended at the ocean, and the main building on the left. Puthoff was at San Andreas airport, which matches the description and drawing Targ produced. 

Yet another experiment had Targ actually leaving the building for once – he didn’t drive normally due to vision issues, although now he’s a legally blind motorcyclist. He ended up in New Orleans, and threw a die on the pavement to determine where he would go. The die roll led him to the New Orleans Superdome stadium. Standing outside, he recorded his coordinates, along with the date and time, and added that it, “Looks like a flying saucer, shining in the sun.” Back at the lab, another physicist, Gary Langford, who was also a psychic, reported back that, “I’ve a clear picture of a circular building that looks like a UFO. Do you think Russell’s been abducted?”

Gary drew a picture, which looked remarkably accurate. This was Gary’s first remote viewing, although he had experienced other phenomena throughout his life. 

The army had even set up a psychic corps of six army officers, alongside the team at Sri. The six chosen had never done any type of psychic experiments before. They each did six trials a week for 36 trials, total. The statistical average by chance of what Targ terms, “First place matches,” – that is, matches with a high level of verifiable accuracy produced on the first try – would be six. They got 19 first place matches. Pat price would generally get seven of nine. And Targ says that if Puthoff had been kidnapped nine times, Price would have found him seven times on his first try.

Zoe: [00:10:44] Wow. 

Mike: [00:10:45] Hella Hammid was a long time friend of Targ and a professional photographer. She was brought in as a control subject. That is someone who supposedly has no psychic ability, used to gauge the abilities of a “normal person,” in order to contrast how the others in the program were doing. She ended up becoming the most proficient and reliable person in the program for the decade.

Targ even made $120,000 by having a group psychically predict silver futures on the stock market, by predicting if the silver market would go up a little, or a lot, or down a little, or a lot, and nine out of the nine predictions were correct, netting his company the cash.

 Russell believes in psychic ability and believes that he has proven that it works. He references the studies done on aspirin, using the effect size, which is a determination of how powerful the effects of your experiment were. The effect size on aspirin trials was 0.06 on standard deviations. And that effect size meant that the effect was so obvious, that the trial was stopped, as it had obviously been proven to work.

 Targ’s effect sizes were generally 10 times the asprin experiments in effect size. Targ states it is a natural, innate ability, and that anyone can learn it and practice it to become better at it, like any skill. He says you don’t need to pay thousands of dollars to learn, nor do you need to, “Eat porridge at the foot of your guru,” – You just need to learn to quiet your mind, stop guessing and naming things, and believe that you are, “Made of more than meat and potatoes,” and you can move your awareness independent of space and time, into a transcendent space. 

So what do you think? 

Zoe: [00:12:30] So you believe in it?

Mike: [00:12:32] I’m, I’m probably like you are with ghosts – I’m on the cusp. I think there’s a good chance. Now,  I read on Russell Targ’s Wikipedia page; there was quite a bit about people who have refuted his work, and said that there were things that they did do and they shouldn’t have done, or that they didn’t do, and they should have done and things like that.

Zoe: [00:12:53] Right.

Mike: [00:12:54] And they say that some people are so good at picking up on cues, perhaps even unconsciously, that they were picking up on cues from Russell or whoever was in the lab with them. 

Zoe: [00:13:07] You sort of thinking like, Sherlock, like the modern day, you know, 

Mike: [00:13:12] Kind of, yeah. 

Zoe: [00:13:12] Cumberbatch Sherlock, looking at the…

Mike: [00:13:14] Kind of what they call cold reading. 

Zoe: [00:13:16] Yeah.

Mike: [00:13:16] So just picking up on visual cues, from things going on in, in the room and things. Russell has written, and I’ve, I’ve put a link to it in the show notes; Russell has written a rebuttal to Wikipedia, and if you watch the, Third Eye Spies documentary, he states on there that he got banned from Wikipedia, because he kept putting in stuff about his work with lasers, and they kept taking it out, going,  “Nobody’s really interested in that, they just want to know about the spooky stuff.” And he was like,

Zoe: [00:13:46] Well that’s rude!

Mike: [00:13:46] My work on lasers was pivotal and, you know, 

Zoe: [00:13:49] Yeah! How odd?

Mike: [00:13:51] And they kept taking it out. So he refutes a lot of the refutations on Wikipedia, and says that they’re really biased and their editors, just decide what they want, kind of thing. 

Zoe: [00:14:01] Yeah. So one thing that I did pick up on, I didn’t realize before, because I’ve heard a bit about this before, is that, it’s the issue with time. 

Mike: [00:14:12] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:14:13] Like picking up on things before they happen. To me, that’s not remote viewing. That’s that’s telling the future. 

 Mike: [00:14:22] Yeah. Well, there’s a, it’s just the idea that the human consciousness can exist separate of its physical body, and also separate, independently from space and time.

Zoe: [00:14:35] So here’s a thought then: What if ghosts are not ghosts of dead people, they are people remote viewing? 

Mike: [00:14:43] Yeah. They’re like astrally projecting or something like that.

Zoe: [00:14:45] From like, but from the past, or like from the future – either way, because if you’re saying, 

Mike: [00:14:52] Yeah. They want to see what the future’s like

Zoe: [00:14:52] Yeah!

Mike: [00:14:52] That’s, that’s an interesting idea.

Zoe: [00:14:54] Because if you’re saying that that guy saw, was it the Chinese bomb test?

Mike: [00:14:59] Yeah, 

Zoe: [00:15:01] Three days before it happened, and it failed and he saw that, could he not have been a ghost there? 

Mike: [00:15:08] Yeah.  It’s interesting, because  they did the remote viewing before the test was due. 

Zoe: [00:15:14] Yeah. 

Mike: [00:15:15] But it’s not very clear on the documentary as to whether they looked into the future and saw the bomb failing. Or just looked at it at the time and went, actually, it doesn’t look like it’s going to work or whatever.  So I’m not sure if that was like a prediction or not, but yeah, I mean, the idea

Zoe: [00:15:32] The thing with the water towers! 

Mike: [00:15:34] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:15:34] That was… 

Mike: [00:15:35] He saw the site 75 years earlier. And that’s apparently completely possible. 

Zoe: [00:15:41] Yeah.

Mike: [00:15:42] And, also the banking on the silver futures on the stock market.

Zoe: [00:15:45] Yeah. That was… 

Mike: [00:15:46] I think that was after Sri and Russell had formed another company to do more research. But yeah, it’s interesting. It’s also interesting, because , in the documentary, they actually come to Cambridge. 

Zoe: [00:15:58] Do they?

Mike: [00:15:59] Yeah. They come to Cambridge and speak to a physicist at Cambridge who is completely on board with this stuff.

Zoe: [00:16:05] Interesting.

Mike: [00:16:05] Yeah.

Zoe: [00:16:07] So, these remote viewers have helped out on police cases. 

Mike: [00:16:12] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:16:13] What do they come under? What, is their formal, you know, do they call them psychics? 

Mike: [00:16:18] Honestly, I don’t know. I don’t know what the police call them. I would say they would probably call them citizen consultants or something like that, but  you can find lots of police cases that have had psychics help that help out on them.

Zoe: [00:16:33] I always feel like they’re  laughed at a bit, or kind of, they’re portrayed in this way of it’s it’s like a, a lady with a, with a shawl and, and, and 

being all kind of, “ooooh! Yes!” 

Mike: [00:16:45] And the crystal balls and all that kind of thing. Yeah, absolutely. And , that’s kind of one of the things that’s dogged Russell Targ and Hal Puthoff through both of their careers, is this idea of the giggle factor.

Zoe: [00:16:56] Yeah.

Mike: [00:16:56] People can’t take it seriously because they can’t believe it’s real. But he asserts, it’s all completely real and that it needs taking seriously, because we could learn a lot by doing research on it. 

Zoe: [00:17:07] Yeah. I’m totally going to download that app and train.

Mike: [00:17:10] Yeah, I’ve already got it, yeah.

Zoe: [00:17:11] Well, cause I’ve got the, what was the one that I’ve got?

Mike: [00:17:13] We’ve got another app called RV Tournament. 

Zoe: [00:17:16] Yeah, and I’m doing pretty well on that.

Mike: [00:17:17] You’re doing really well on that. You’re doing… I keep forgetting to do it, but other than 

Zoe: [00:17:22] So yeah, you actually have to be in it to win it. 

Mike: [00:17:24] Yeah. So RV tournament, if you’re interested in trying remote viewing, you can download an app, and it gives you a set of coordinates, and you have to concentrate on the coordinates and just draw on the screen any impressions that you get. Once you finished that it shows you two images, and you have to say which one you think you got the impressions from; and then the next day, it shows you whether you were right or not. 

Zoe: [00:17:47] Yeah. I feel like I’ve stared at the digits quite a lot.

Mike: [00:17:51] Yeah, there was, Hella Hammid, who was a long time friend of Russell Targ, who, 

Zoe: [00:17:56] Can you just refresh…

Mike: [00:17:57] She came in as the control subject, 

Zoe: [00:17:59] Who was actually turned out to be the best…

Mike: [00:18:00] Who actually turned out to be one of the best ones yeah. In the whole program.

There was one thing where they gave her a set of coordinates, and she began drawing her impressions of it. And it was, she said, it’s like a belly button shaped building with four lines coming off it.

Zoe: [00:18:16] A belly button?

Mike: [00:18:17] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:18:18] But like, is she an inny or an outie?

Mike: [00:18:20] I don’t know. I think it was, I think it must have been an outie. But she, she drew this thing and then she also sculpted it out of clay. And… 

Zoe: [00:18:28] Mashed potato? 

Mike: [00:18:29] No, no, it wasn’t her medium for some reason. 

Zoe: [00:18:33] Oh.

Mike: [00:18:33] No, she drew that and it was a, I can’t remember exactly where it was, but it was a Bevatron, which is like a particle accelerator type thing, where they had these four long tubes, but the four long tubes are under the ground.

Zoe: [00:18:45] Wow. So she could see through the earth as well. 

Mike: [00:18:47] In theory, yeah – but  Russell says about that particular one –  her drawing matches the drawing, the plan that they showed her afterwards. So he thinks she cheated. She didn’t actually remote view the site, she just remote viewed the future, looked at the plan that he showed her afterwards as the answer, and then drew that.

Zoe: [00:19:07] Oh, wow. But even that is like, well impressive. 

Mike: [00:19:10] Yeah, it’s like the most impressive way of cheating. I mean, honestly, if  you can cheat like that in exams, by reading the paper from the future,  I think that should just give you it. Cause why not? 

Zoe: [00:19:21] So if you are kind of down with this, on the cusp as it were, how do you feel about tarot cards? Because surely then they’re just a, a kind of a help? 

Mike: [00:19:33] They’re a tool aren’t they really? Yeah. So they’re a tool to help people focus their intentions. Now I have this big theory that, intention is the biggest driving force behind everything.

If there is such a thing as psychic space, I think intention causes ripples in psychic space, the way that planets cause ripples in spacetime, in gravity. Just to put that one out there. 

Zoe: [00:19:58] You’re getting a little bit technical now love, and my brain’s kind of going, “errrrrr!”

Mike: [00:20:01] Yeah.

Zoe: [00:20:02] Okay. Cause like have you ever had your tarot cards, read? Or like your, your fortune, read by anybody? 

Mike: [00:20:08] Not professionally, I’ve had a couple of amateur readings and stuff like that, which have been interesting. But yeah, I think with tarot cards that the meanings are so vague, you can make them fit any narrative really, a lot of the time. 

Zoe: [00:20:21] Well yeah, but that’s the whole point, isn’t it? They’re supposed to be… not like a, “This means definitely this,” it’s part of  the person giving the reading uses that as a jumping off point as like a, not an inspiration, but like, “Right that will relate to this.” It’s like the death card,  it does not mean you’re going to die. It could mean that something’s coming to an end, but it could also mean that something will begin.  Cause what is the difference between staring at eight digits for 15 minutes, to try and think of an image, to looking at several pictures to then gain a sort of like… bring in a story, to pull a story in from the ether?

Mike: [00:21:04] Yeah. Well, that’s an interesting point actually, because there’s another book that I’ve been reading recently, called The Secret History of the World.

Zoe: [00:21:11] Yes, I remember digging that out. 

Mike: [00:21:13] Yep. Part of that is talking about how people in ancient times, how their worldview differ to ours quite drastically. So somebody taking a walk in the woods would see signs and portents everywhere.

You know, if an owl landed on a tree branch, it was a God or a Goddess watching over them perhaps, or, you know, a sudden breeze might mean something else, and everything was filled with intention. Everything had some kind of consciousness behind it. And the idea in the Secret History of the World is that, instead of the world being a materialistic thing, it’s the world of thoughts and ideas that are the real thing, and the world of matter kind of emanates from it. It’s a mind before matter argument. So in the old days, people didn’t think, “Ooh, I’ve just had a really interesting thought!” They thought of thoughts, ‘peopling’ rather than people thinking. 

Zoe: [00:22:11] I’m sorry, wha…?

Mike: [00:22:12] So, yeah. So there’s essentially like a, kind of an etheric sea of ideas, 

Zoe: [00:22:17] So that they… that would just come through.

Mike: [00:22:19] Yeah. And they are the conduit for that idea. 

Zoe: [00:22:22] Okay. 

Mike: [00:22:23] And that idea might be, you know, spoken by a God, or spirit or whatever, 

Zoe: [00:22:27] A Muse!

Mike: [00:22:28] And they just serve as the conduit for it.  And, it mentions things like artistic abilities and things – sometimes people have periods where they’re vastly prolific for a while and they, everything they touch turns to gold, kind of thing. 

Zoe: [00:22:41] Yeah.

Mike: [00:22:42] And then maybe just as suddenly, it leaves them. And in the olden days that would have been this spirit or… 

Zoe: [00:22:49] Right, ok.

Mike: [00:22:49] …animating idea, coursing through your body and using you as a tool to achieve whatever its intention was.

Zoe: [00:22:56] Interesting.

Mike: [00:22:57] Yeah. It’s a kind of completely topsy turvy way to how we think about the world now, but it’s interesting to think about.

Zoe: [00:23:02] But do you not think that’s partly to do with how much technology we have now, and how we’re not actually in tune with like, the Earth and life as we were? We don’t sort of respect and worship life, and the Earth as we did.

Mike: [00:23:18] Yeah. We don’t kind of venerate things in the way that we used to, but it’s, it’s also kind of the scientific mindset as well, of reducing things to there. Kind of base essence and then, “Okay well, we know what that is now. We know what that’s made out of.” 

Zoe: [00:23:33] We’ve lost the magic. We’re all jaded. 

Mike: [00:23:35] Yeah. Like I say, Russell Targ is a professional physicist, and he says that the further and further down you go, you know, we, we found out things were made of molecules and then we found out molecules are made of atoms.

Then we found out atoms are made of protons and neutrons and electrons. And we found out those were made of gluons and masons and all the rest of it. And he says, once you go kind of down and down and down, there is this unified field, which seems to exist separately, independently of space and time, so it’s like an almost… 

Zoe: [00:24:03] Hang on a minute! Isn’t that where Ant-man went?

Mike: [00:24:05] Kind of yeah. Well, he went subatomic. Yes. 

Zoe: [00:24:08] Yeah! Woooo!

Mike: [00:24:10] But it’s more like, if you’ve ever watched, Star Trek Discovery, 

Zoe: [00:24:15] No.

Mike: [00:24:15] The newest series – they have a thing whereby they travel using mycelium networks, which is a kind of type of fungus. I know it sounds weird. But it’s kind of like quantum entanglement, two particles can be entangled, and if you cause one particle to rotate in a particular way, the other one rotates in the same way, regardless of distance, at the same time. So you could have two particles at either end of the universe, and if you started spinning one in a particular direction, the other one would do it at the same time. 

Zoe: [00:24:52] How does that work for travel? 

Mike: [00:24:54] We don’t really know.

Zoe: [00:24:56] Because it’s a fictional series!

Mike: [00:24:58] It’s a fictional series.

Zoe: [00:24:59] Okay. Dammit!

Mike: [00:24:59] But the idea being, that there is maybe some kind of subatomic, unified field, where… 

Zoe: [00:25:07] Oh, you’re baking my noodle now love! 

Mike: [00:25:09] …everything stems from this oneness, you see?  And the idea is that it’s that unified field that you’re accessing when you go into a particular kind of psychic state, which means that you can do things irrespective of state and time, because everything is… 

Zoe: [00:25:25] Relative?

Mike: [00:25:25] …part of the same thing. No, everything is one. Effectively. 

Zoe: [00:25:28] Yeah. See, I find all of that, it’s so big that my brain just goes, “It’s Alice through the looking glass!” That kind of thing. Cause that’s the only way I can kind of accept it. It’s… so mad.

Mike: [00:25:39] Yeah, it is a little bit, basically once you get down to the subatomic stuff. Once you get into quantum mechanics and things like that, things get really weird.

And we know that that’s how things work at the subatomic level, but we can’t figure out  how to bridge the gap between what’s happening there and what’s happening – the kind of classical physics level that we experience, as everyday life and matter. 

Zoe: [00:26:02] Oh, mate!

Mike: [00:26:04] Yeah, not quite as funny this time, but by God, I’m going to bake your noodle.

Zoe: [00:26:07] It’s already, it’s done. It’s like ready to come out – like, “Ding!”

Mike: [00:26:13] But yeah, it’s interesting, cause there was a thing I was reading the other day that was saying that tomato plants apparently communicate via a fungus. So there’s like… 

Zoe: [00:26:22] And they… no, they speak!

Mike: [00:26:23] …spores of a fungus over the whole field and 

Zoe: [00:26:25] Someone told me…

Mike: [00:26:25] the tomato plants. No, I told you that vegetables can hear themselves being chewed.

Zoe: [00:26:31] What? No, you didn’t tell me that. That’s horrid!

Mike: [00:26:32] Yeah I did. I did! I told you that because I said, Oh, as vegans, we’re now stuffed because even the food that we think isn’t being… 

Zoe: [00:26:37] No! You have not told me this!

Mike: [00:26:39] I have told you this, I swear to god! 

Zoe: [00:26:42] Ok, I wasn’t listening. I wasn’t listening when you told me this!

Mike: [00:26:45] Yeah, well that’s a different thing love!

Zoe: [00:26:47] I was subatomic. Or something.

Mike: [00:26:47] Yeah. So if tomato plants can,  communicate over this fungal network. 

Zoe: [00:26:54] Screaming. 

Mike: [00:26:54] Yeah, but that’s the idea behind the Star Trek Discovery thing.

Zoe: [00:26:57] The silence of the tomatoes!

Mike: [00:27:00] That’s the idea behind the Star Trek thing is that this fungal mycelium network that they have is connected to every point in the universe. So you can just skip between points.

Zoe: [00:27:11] Fungus.

Mike: [00:27:12] Yeah. And it takes you there. 

Zoe: [00:27:14] Because there’s not Mushroom!

Mike: [00:27:16] Oh, my word. Did you do that?

Zoe: [00:27:19] Ooooh, boom! 

Mike: [00:27:20] Oh!

Zoe: [00:27:20] Sorry. I’m so sorry. 

Mike: [00:27:22] Podcaster down. Oh man.

Zoe: [00:27:26] Oh, that was horrible. I’m sorry.

Mike: [00:27:28] They had a couple of other people that I didn’t actually mention that did stuff for them as well. There was one guy who was known as remote viewer 001, a guy named McMonagle, who was a, I think he was an army chief or general or something like that, and got into doing psychic spying and stuff.

And, yeah, that was craziness that went on there. He was so good, it was unbelievable almost, you know, again, depending on why you sit with this kind of stuff, 

Zoe: [00:27:54] See I didn’t realize it was quite so widespread. I thought it was like, you know, ” The Men Who Stared At Goats,” and it was like, oh yeah, one off, and there was that one who like, you know, saw the facility and probably shouldn’t have, and… 

Mike: [00:28:07] Yeah, well that came about because, Hal Puthoff gave them some coordinates to a cabin he’d built in West Virginia,

Zoe: [00:28:15] Right.

Mike: [00:28:16] And they scoped out the site, saw a small log cabin or whatever, and went, “Well that’s not very interesting!” Had a bit of a look around, found a completely classified NSA national security agency site.

Zoe: [00:28:30] Hang on a minute, when was this?

Mike: [00:28:31] About a mile down the road. This was, possibly eighties, seventies, eighties. Something like that. Probably eighties I think.

Zoe: [00:28:39] Not the sixties then, cause you know, we were talking about the munitions site, just North of Point Pleasant,

Mike: [00:28:45] Yeah!

Zoe: [00:28:45] Because that closed down, like literally, they shut up shop the day after Hiroshima. 

Mike: [00:28:51] Wow. So they were making stuff for the bomb, apparently.

Zoe: [00:28:55] It was, it was, yeah.

Mike: [00:28:55] Hence, radioactive, mutant, giant…  

Zoe: [00:28:58] Mothmen!

Mike: [00:28:58] Moth people! 

Zoe: [00:28:59] Yeah. So I’m just wondering, cause it’s like West Virginia, if they saw his thingy and went, “Oh, well go there instead.” But if it, the timing was all wrong.

Mike: [00:29:05] Yeah, I dunno, basically – yeah. He found the filing cabinets in there and read the names of the drawers, and then read the names of the file folders on them, and they were all to do with Pool, like they were pool terms, like “Rack ’em up,” and “Cue ball,” and things like that. 

Zoe: [00:29:20] Sounds like James Bond to me. 

Mike: [00:29:22] And aparently the NSA got heavily involved. Literally there were NSA agents and people, very high ranking people, at Stanford Research Institute the next day, asking them a lot of questions.

Zoe: [00:29:37] Men In Black?

Mike: [00:29:37] Cause  they were like, “There’s been a security leak. This is the only way that you could know this stuff.” Cause  this wasn’t just top secret. This was, special access projects. So it was literally… there were a handful of people in the world that knew these things, and they were like, 

Zoe: [00:29:55] And a few more now!

Mike: [00:29:55] How the hell do you know? But also, if you can do this, has Russia got people spying on our top secret folders? And is there even a point in trying to hide anything anymore? If you can just wander in from halfway across the world and read it all?

Zoe: [00:30:11] We want transparency? You might as well just, all out in the open. Saves… 

Mike: [00:30:14] Well apparently, remote viewing makes everything transparent. To a certain extent.

Zoe: [00:30:18] Exactly! Exactly! Just, you know, why bother trying to hide? We’ll find out in the end. 

Mike: [00:30:21] But the documentary is really worth a watch if you’re even slightly interested in this stuff, cause they show all sorts of stuff like this and they show, Ingo Swann who showed Russell Targ and Hal Puthoff how to do it. He showed them how  to do remote viewing. And one of the things he did to prove that he could do it, was, they had at SRI, a magnetically and electronically sealed magnetometer, to test for…

Zoe: [00:30:48] Which is a… for? 

Mike: [00:30:48] It tests for, I think they were testing for like nuclear explosions or background radiation, or earthquakes? I can’t…honestly I can’t remember. 

Zoe: [00:30:56] Is it like the little thing they use in Ghostbusters with the little arms that goes [makes sound effect]?

Mike: [00:30:59] No, this thing is a big room full of stuff. 

Zoe: [00:31:01] Ok.

Mike: [00:31:02] Yeah. But like completely hermetically sealed, magnetically sealed electrically sealed, and he said, “I can make that needle move from outside of the room.” And he did. And that’s when the CIA got involved. Cause they were like, “That’s not possible. You can’t, literally, that’s completely sealed.” 

Zoe: [00:31:20] Unless – he didn’t make it move, but he knew that it would move, for some other reason. 

Mike: [00:31:27] Well  I guess, yeah. That’s I suppose, a thing.

Zoe: [00:31:29] Because someone pressed a button they shouldn’t have, 

Mike: [00:31:31] They also show, some Russian people near the end of the documentary taking a seminar, on how to do remote viewing. And, there’s one guy who draws what kind of looks like a pepperoni pizza. And he’s like, “I thought it was maybe the moon,  and I got this impression of this and that and the other,” and his target turned out to be the moon landing with Neil Armstrong.

But there’s like, there’s links from this sort of stuff into astral projection and things like that, where, you know, people believe that you can separate your consciousness from your body and then go off and look at stuff. 

Zoe: [00:32:08] Well, just a little snippet: So my great grandmother was, I believe, 96 when she died. She was in a home. She had her own room in the home, and in the weeks that led up to her death, obviously we didn’t know she was going to die, but she was telling my Nan, when she went into visit,  she would say, “They lifted me up again last night.”

Mike: [00:32:34] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:32:34] And Nan didn’t know what she meant,  and she said, “Oh, last night, they lifted the bed up and I got all the way up to…” and she mentioned something that was on a picture. So, she had a picture on the wall beside her bed  and she said, “I got all the way up to…” and said something on there, and it was a good meter. 

Mike: [00:32:52] Yeah.

Zoe: [00:32:52] That they weren’t raising her bed. 

Mike: [00:32:53] No.

Zoe: [00:32:53] Her bed was a normal bedstead. 

Mike: [00:32:55] Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:32:56] But… 

Mike: [00:32:57] She felt like she was… being moved upwards.

Zoe: [00:32:58] She, she, like literally she said it was almost like every other night. She thought the bed was being lifted. 

Mike: [00:33:04] Interesting. They’re preparing her for takeoff, 

Zoe: [00:33:05] Essentially, she was being prepared! And Nan was like, “It’s a bit strange? They’re lifting her up!” and like…

Mike: [00:33:13] And then, went to look into it, and they’re like, “Uh-uh!” 

Zoe: [00:33:16] Well no, I don’t even think she did, but it was like, we’d obviously visited her, and we’re like, “It’s not a height adjustable bed. It’s just a bed.”

Mike: [00:33:23] Unless I’ve got like, you know, five guys around it. Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:33:25] Like lifting it. And it’s like, “No, that’s, that’s not happening, it’s against a wall.” And why? Why would they be doing that in the middle of the night? 

Mike: [00:33:31] Just a random group of bodybuilders ran in, lifted the bed, and then went, “Yeah, Ooh! That’ll do for now!”

Zoe: [00:33:36] Yeah. But she wasn’t saying anything like, Oh, I’m having out of body experiences. 

Mike: [00:33:41] No, no, she thought whe was still in her body.

Zoe: [00:33:42] She, she thought that her bed was being lifted up. But it wasn’t. And it’s one of those weird little things that’s just stuck with me. 

And I’m going to say actually, when it comes to this kind of thing, I do believe in it because I do believe that, our brains have massive potentials to do all sorts of things that we can’t comprehend. 

Mike: [00:34:02] Yeah. Most complicated object in the universe that we know about is the human brain. 

Zoe: [00:34:07] So, you know, it’s almost like the potential is limitless if we allow it. 

Mike: [00:34:13] Yeah, absolutely. And,  There’s  a TEDx talk, which Russell was going to do and they canceled on him. So, in that Russell speaks about the fact that there’s a 1200 year old book, that’s from the Buddhists that basically say about, “Quiet your mind. Don’t try and name things. Don’t try and label things. don’t guess. And just see the amazing pictures that come to mind and kind of make notes about them.” Which is essentially like an early remote viewing manual, as such.


Yep.  Zoe: [00:34:53] But in the meantime, if you’ve enjoyed today, you can, listen to our back catalog, because I can say that now – we’ve got enough to say we’ve got a back catalog.

Mike: [00:35:01] Yup. 

Zoe: [00:35:01] You can find us on Facebook. 

Mike: [00:35:04] of strangeness. 

Zoe: [00:35:08] And we are also on Instagram 

Mike: [00:35:10] @storiesofstrangeness. 

Zoe: [00:35:12] And I think we’re on Twitter as well. 

Mike: [00:35:14] Yep. So strange pod. 

Zoe: [00:35:16] Yeah. I don’t really tweet,

Mike: [00:35:19] I don’t tweet a huge amount either, but if people start getting involved, I will.  We also have a website.

Zoe: [00:35:25] Which is 

Mike: [00:35:29] Yep. 

Zoe: [00:35:30] And we also have a Redbubble account, because with each episode we are creating our very own unique illustrations. So you can plaster them all over your body, or, well, 

Mike: [00:35:40] Home.

Zoe: [00:35:41] Anything you own. There’s all sorts to choose from. Go check it out. That’s Redbubble and you just need to search for Zoe and Mike.

Mike: [00:35:48] There’ll be a link in the show notes. 

Zoe: [00:35:49] And if you have any strange stories of your own that you would like us to read out, if you could email us, our email address is: 

Mike: [00:35:59] 

Zoe: [00:36:02] Yes, and yeah, we’d love to hear from you, because I do believe Mike told me that we’ve got quite a lot of listeners in Canada.

Mike: [00:36:09] Yeah, we’ve got some in Canada. Yeah. 

Zoe: [00:36:11] So, You know, 

Mike: [00:36:12] How are you doing guys? And girls.

Zoe: [00:36:13] Yes. Is it, warm or…

Mike: [00:36:15] Canucks!

Zoe: [00:36:15] …cold over there? I dunno? 

Mike: [00:36:17] Generally it’s a little colder. Although… yeah. 

Zoe: [00:36:19] The one time I visited, there was no snow! 

Mike: [00:36:22] And I’ve never been, but I’d love to go, cause they seem like really nice folk. 

Zoe: [00:36:26] They’re lovely. Give us a shout, say hi! Come find us, find the group. Say hello.

Is that it for today? 

Mike: [00:36:33] I think that’s it for today unless, um, no, that’s it for today. 

Zoe: [00:36:40] Okay. Well thank you so much for joining us! If you could see me at the minute  I’m doing the Peter Venkman sign off. 

Mike: [00:36:48] Yep. Got it. 

Zoe: [00:36:49] Did you get it? 

Mike: [00:36:50] Yeah, that was pretty funny actually.

Zoe: [00:36:51] Yeah. I thought it was funny. 

Mike: [00:36:52] Yeah, it was good. 

Zoe: [00:36:53] Anyway. Thanks for listening. 

Mike: [00:36:56] Thanks for listening. Bye!

Zoe: [00:36:56] Love you!

Mike: [00:36:58] Bye.

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